1st Squat Form Check

[Wakefield]

1st time getting a form check so the more info the better please.
Lifting weight is 80kg.

Stats:
Height - 178cm
Weight - 80kg
Age - 27
Previous Training - 6 months random training in a gym plus sports for quite a few years.

I've included all 3 sets for comparison, only failure is the 5th rep on 2nd set if you want to skip to that.

1st Set - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ran_uY2UWNE
2nd Set - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uAbNF4wx6Yg
3rd Set - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWFmc6toDMk

The main problem I am aware of is the fact that I just cannot keep the bar path vertical, I first squatted 80 kg about a month ago and have yo-yoed up and down purely because my form is not good enough to keep the bar path vertical.

A normal set is the 1st 2 reps are generally fine with the bar path remaining vertical, but normally the 3rd rep slides forward at the very bottom and the remaining two reps simply travel in this fashion \ instead of a |.
It's a bit difficult to tell from this angle but I tape all my sets from the side so I am painfully aware of the 2-3cms the bar travels forward at the very bottom of the squat. It's frustrating because 30-40% of the time my reps are just fine in terms of the bar path, and I cannot tell the difference in what I am doing between good and bad reps.

Thanks.

[BareSteel]

Good effort, Wakefield. These really aren't too bad. I'd like to see you in some more stable footwear. You've got the rack, the bar, the plates...invest in a good pair of lifting shoes. I'd also have you learn to get your chin down a little bit. Should help with the hip drive.

[Adam Skillin]

1st time getting a form check so the more info the better please.
Lifting weight is 80kg.

Stats:
Height - 178cm
Weight - 80kg
Age - 27
Previous Training - 6 months random training in a gym plus sports for quite a few years.

I've included all 3 sets for comparison, only failure is the 5th rep on 2nd set if you want to skip to that.

1st Set - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ran_uY2UWNE
2nd Set - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uAbNF4wx6Yg
3rd Set - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWFmc6toDMk

The main problem I am aware of is the fact that I just cannot keep the bar path vertical, I first squatted 80 kg about a month ago and have yo-yoed up and down purely because my form is not good enough to keep the bar path vertical.

A normal set is the 1st 2 reps are generally fine with the bar path remaining vertical, but normally the 3rd rep slides forward at the very bottom and the remaining two reps simply travel in this fashion \ instead of a |.
It's a bit difficult to tell from this angle but I tape all my sets from the side so I am painfully aware of the 2-3cms the bar travels forward at the very bottom of the squat. It's frustrating because 30-40% of the time my reps are just fine in terms of the bar path, and I cannot tell the difference in what I am doing between good and bad reps.

Thanks.

Get us a video from the side. I suspect there's a little excessive knee slide. The shoes and gaze advice from BareSteel should help too.

[Wakefield]

This is from my session on the 26th, different to the original but the same weight.

Sorry about the black, didn't know I'd be uploading it when I did them:

1st - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Usu1Y9xfrSM
2nd - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yH5NZEA9BWQ
3rd - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVoBub7inEI

[Adam Skillin]

What made you decide to start taking them 4" deeper? The first few in the first set weren't too bad, but they started going a little deep from there. Also, watch your tibias at the end of the descent of each rep. See how the angle increases? We want the knees to stop coming forward 1/3-1/2way down and stay there. It's not extreme, but it's definitely there. Remember, we want the hamstrings to be at their full resting length when we start the ascent. Both of these things result in slackened hamstrings, and slackened hamstrings cannot contribute effectively to the lift like non-slackened hamstrings can.

You need to put a mark on the wall right in front of you that you can stare at. Whatever would have you looking at a spot on the floor 4-6 feet in front of you, if there was such a floor. I'm not sure where this will turn out to be, but I'm guessing somewhere around sternum height.

You're doing a lot of things right too, they're just not as fun to talk about.

[FarewelltoArms]

These aren't bad at all - good work. Take BareSteel's advice on the footwear - a more stable base + raised heel will help you get your bar path straightened out. Best investment you'll make outside of the book itself.

[Wakefield]

What made you decide to start taking them 4" deeper? The first few in the first set weren't too bad, but they started going a little deep from there.

Wasn't aware that they were going that low, when I watch them immediately after I use the red marks on the upright supports as parallel.
Now that it's been mentioned I do see that the majority of the forward bar movement comes from the last few cms.

Also, watch your tibias at the end of the descent of each rep. See how the angle increases? We want the knees to stop coming forward 1/3-1/2way down and stay there.

The angle with the knee joint or the ankle joint? Or the angle of the tibia itself?

The way I mentally process the movement is to push my butt back first to allow it to drop, then push my knees forward when my hamstrings tighten a few cm above parallel.
I will change it to move my knees forward at the same time, just doing a few air squats then it seems to have stopped my knees going forward at the end and it feels a lot more fluid too.

It's not extreme, but it's definitely there. Remember, we want the hamstrings to be at their full resting length when we start the descent. Both of these things result in slackened hamstrings, and slackened hamstrings cannot contribute effectively to the lift like non-slackened hamstrings can.

Do you mean the ascent? Or make sure I am standing up straight before I drop?

You need to put a mark on the wall right in front of you that you can stare at. Whatever would have you looking at a spot on the floor 4-6 feet in front of you, if there was such a floor. I'm not sure where this will turn out to be, but I'm guessing somewhere around sternum height.

It's a bit hard to see in the video, but there is actually a sticky note on the wall for me to focus on, But now it's pointed out I do realise that I've been raising my gaze quite a bit recently.

You're doing a lot of things right too, they're just not as fun to talk about.

Only for discussions with my workout buddy about what we disagree on.

Good effort, Wakefield. These really aren't too bad. I'd like to see you in some more stable footwear. You've got the rack, the bar, the plates...invest in a good pair of lifting shoes. I'd also have you learn to get your chin down a little bit. Should help with the hip drive.

Thanks, shoes are next on the list.

[Mike Troxell]

What made you decide to start taking them 4" deeper? The first few in the first set weren't too bad, but they started going a little deep from there. Also, watch your tibias at the end of the descent of each rep. See how the angle increases? We want the knees to stop coming forward 1/3-1/2way down and stay there. It's not extreme, but it's definitely there. Remember, we want the hamstrings to be at their full resting length when we start the ascent. Both of these things result in slackened hamstrings, and slackened hamstrings cannot contribute effectively to the lift like non-slackened hamstrings can.

If a lifter has the ability to squat 4" below parallel and stops at parallel, how do they benefit from the stretch reflex? Also, are the hamstrings loaded by the forward tilt of the torso during a deep squat? Assuming the knees are in the correct position?

Thanks.

[Adam Skillin]

If a lifter has the ability to squat 4" below parallel and stops at parallel, how do they benefit from the stretch reflex?

I don't understand the question. Are you under the impression that the stretch reflex requires maximum flexion of a joint to occur? Any time the concentric contraction is preceded by an eccentric one, there's a stretch reflex. If you want to do a SVJ, you don't squat ATG, you dip down about 3 inches. The stretch-shortening cycle is what causes a stretch reflex.

Also, are the hamstrings loaded by the forward tilt of the torso during a deep squat? Assuming the knees are in the correct position?

I'm quite unsure what you're asking, but I'll give this a go anyway. The hamstrings are hip extensors. If what you mean by "tilted forward" is hip flexion, then I'd say yes, this would appear to be a requirement for maximal hamstring involvement. But if the torso is not "tilted forward" (for instance, in a front squat), then keeping the center of mass over the center of balance requires slackened hamstrings at the bottom anyway. And slackened hamstrings cannot contribute effectively to the lift, in either a concentric or isometric fashion.

tl, dr: Yeah, the correctly performed low-bar squat, with its more horizontal back angle, and the more "hips back" position it requires allows for greater involvement of the hamstrings than squatting with the barbell in any position higher on the back.

[trapntan]

Adam did a good job here, I would just add that a squatter able to go 4" below parallel must do so with a relaxed lumbar, and this is not our goal in the squat.