Squats Too Deep? (Paging Michael Wolf)

[notetcetera]

I've worked up to 330lb for my squat since you helped me clean up my squat form, but I think I've started dropping too far below parallel. I only have a video from the side, I know it's not optimal, sorry buddy!
325lb x 5

Also, I managed to twist my left knee a weird way yesterday, after I got home from the gym. It only hurts (probably a 2 or 3 on a scale of 10) when I step up or down, but it's fine on level surfaces and when I squat down.

I'm going to squat on Tuesday if it doesn't hurt (or is a 1 or 2 in pain), but if it stays the same or gets worse, should I do anything differently?

Thanks

Greg

[Michael Wolf]

Good job man, you were at what, about 280 or so when I saw you in the summer?

Self diagnosis is correct, those are deeper than they need to be. Stay tighter going down - force yourself to control the speed of your descent and not fall into the hole, and drive your hips up when you get an inch below parallel.

One other thing here is your back angle. Lean over more on the way down, don't fight it and try to stay too vertical. Notice the bar is actually over the rear of your foot on the way down and at the bounce. There's a very slow part where the bar has to get back over mid foot and your back angle corrects on the way back up, then it starts moving again. If you keep that bar over mid-foot the whole way, by leaning over more on the way down, you will do a lot to reduce that grind.

[bugbomb]

Just chiming in to say that this vid and response was very helpful to me. I have a similar problem going too deep, and I'll try Coach Wolf's suggestions.

[Clay Lacey]

Very helpful video/trainee/coach interaction on this thread. Thanks to both of you for posting.

[notetcetera]

Good job man, you were at what, about 280 or so when I saw you in the summer?

Self diagnosis is correct, those are deeper than they need to be. Stay tighter going down - force yourself to control the speed of your descent and not fall into the hole, and drive your hips up when you get an inch below parallel.

One other thing here is your back angle. Lean over more on the way down, don't fight it and try to stay too vertical. Notice the bar is actually over the rear of your foot on the way down and at the bounce. There's a very slow part where the bar has to get back over mid foot and your back angle corrects on the way back up, then it starts moving again. If you keep that bar over mid-foot the whole way, by leaning over more on the way down, you will do a lot to reduce that grind.

Welp, I didn't seem to do much better this week. I did 325x 3 sets x 5 reps on Tuesday, trying to fix my back angle, speed and depth. The back angle seems to be the only thing I fixed, but now I'm going forward of my midfoot. As for the depth and speed of the descent, I'm still messing both of those up-- I'm having a hard time controlling the speed of my descent at near-5rm weights and I have almost no kinesthetic sense in terms of depth.

Here's a video of the second work set: http://youtu.be/lIKEf8MUgqY



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[notetcetera]

Just chiming in to say that this vid and response was very helpful to me. I have a similar problem going too deep, and I'll try Coach Wolf's suggestions.

Cool, hope you cleaned it up man.

Very helpful video/trainee/coach interaction on this thread. Thanks to both of you for posting.

Thanks for the kind words, bud.




Sent from my iPhone

[notetcetera]

Good job man, you were at what, about 280 or so when I saw you in the summer?

Self diagnosis is correct, those are deeper than they need to be. Stay tighter going down - force yourself to control the speed of your descent and not fall into the hole, and drive your hips up when you get an inch below parallel.

One other thing here is your back angle. Lean over more on the way down, don't fight it and try to stay too vertical. Notice the bar is actually over the rear of your foot on the way down and at the bounce. There's a very slow part where the bar has to get back over mid foot and your back angle corrects on the way back up, then it starts moving again. If you keep that bar over mid-foot the whole way, by leaning over more on the way down, you will do a lot to reduce that grind.

Thanks, Wolf I appreciate that! Yeah, I was right around there when I met with you; that coaching session made a huge difference for me in my progression.


Sent from my iPhone

[Michael Wolf]

Welp, I didn't seem to do much better this week. I did 325x 3 sets x 5 reps on Tuesday, trying to fix my back angle, speed and depth. The back angle seems to be the only thing I fixed, but now I'm going forward of my midfoot. As for the depth and speed of the descent, I'm still messing both of those up-- I'm having a hard time controlling the speed of my descent at near-5rm weights and I have almost no kinesthetic sense in terms of depth.

Here's a video of the second work set: http://youtu.be/lIKEf8MUgqY

Sent from my iPhone

You know, I didn't catch this the first time around, but you're sitting back first instead of breaking hips and knees together. I went back to check and yup, you were doing this in the first video you posted as well. So what's happening now is you improved your back angle and depth, but are still falling into the bottom and shifting forward there because you're too loose. Previously, when you had the bar behind mid-foot, this didn't shift the bar forward of midfoot because you were so far behind. But now that you're in a better position on the way down, you need to stay tight to KEEP this position, instead of letting it go by being loose and shifting forward.

So I'll repeat part of my advice from your OP: Stay Tighter! Slow and tight on the way down. But initiate the movement with knees and hips together, then once you're about halfway down, knees only go out and hips continue to go down/back.

The only way to get a better kinesthetic sense of staying tight and depth is to keep doing it, while being cognizant of those things. Keep plugging away, it will improve.

Thanks, Wolf I appreciate that! Yeah, I was right around there when I met with you; that coaching session made a huge difference for me in my progression.

Sent from my iPhone

Glad it helped so much, especially given your less than ideal NYC accommodations and the old Raslan cough.

[notetcetera]

You know, I didn't catch this the first time around, but you're sitting back first instead of breaking hips and knees together. I went back to check and yup, you were doing this in the first video you posted as well. So what's happening now is you improved your back angle and depth, but are still falling into the bottom and shifting forward there because you're too loose. Previously, when you had the bar behind mid-foot, this didn't shift the bar forward of midfoot because you were so far behind. But now that you're in a better position on the way down, you need to stay tight to KEEP this position, instead of letting it go by being loose and shifting forward.

So I'll repeat part of my advice from your OP: Stay Tighter! Slow and tight on the way down. But initiate the movement with knees and hips together, then once you're about halfway down, knees only go out and hips continue to go down/back.

The only way to get a better kinesthetic sense of staying tight and depth is to keep doing it, while being cognizant of those things. Keep plugging away, it will improve.

Thanks for the quick response.

Ah! I think sitting back may be why it's been harder to control the descent. I'm headed to the gym now, lets see if I can't get this cleaned up today.

Glad it helped so much, especially given your less than ideal NYC accommodations and the old Raslan cough.

Hahaha! Apparently, not smoking/being around smoke is GOOD for the body?!





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[notetcetera]

I tried to clean up the form a little more today... I think I got the back angle and the knees / hips. The descent seems to fluctuate and my depth is dependent on that. For some reason it feels much harder to not go super deep?
Also, the 4th rep on the third set is a bit high, right?
330lb x 2 sets x 5 reps