When to add cleans and chin-ups

[nipperkin]

So I got PPST 3rd edition and started the novice routine, and I'm not sure when to alter the program to include power cleans and then chin-ups/pull-ups. I'm able to dead lift 315x2, which is not a whole lot, but I don't know if I really need to get "used" to the movement as the book describes, before adding cleans and chins. Regardless, I started my 1x5 deadlift today at 155 because why the hell not. I can currently do 10 chin ups with a 25 lb weight attached. My main concern is that I don't want to lose my chin up strength if I postpone adding them until several weeks later...what do?

[hollismb]

Do you have SSBBT3? The programming chapter there will help you answer those questions. But, basically, since you started your deadlift a lot lighter (155) than you say you can pull (315X2), you're served best by continuing to practice that (newer for you?) form while it's easy to still add a bunch of weight each workout for a couple weeks, before you introduce the powerclean. You can either continue to do some chins maybe every other workout, or once a week, or leave them out for the first couple weeks while you're deadlifting every workout.

[G1981C]

i personally would not stop any exercise for more than 2 weeks. if you're afraid it will somehow mess up your programming do it light / easy, but i would not completely stop any exercise for more than 2 weeks as i said.

the danger is not so much losing strength, but that you will get hurt once you start doing the exercise again if you haven't done it in a long time. strength has a lot to do with nervous system, but injury is in the muscle. in my experience when you stop working out the muscle starts to deteriorate instantly while strength continues growing for a while due to nervous system recovery. when you restart the training later what happens is now your nervous system is stronger than your muscle and injury is likely.

[nipperkin]

Thanks for the input!

Any other thoughts on this?

[Adam Skillin]

Why did you start deadlifts at 155 if you can pull 315 for a double? What are you squatting presently?

[nipperkin]

Why did you start deadlifts at 155 if you can pull 315 for a double? What are you squatting presently?

I started off light with the deadlift to perfect the form. My squat is somewhere at 5x185, but I started off at 3x5x95 because I wanted to perfect the form too and it's also been a while since I squatted. I assumed that there was nothing wrong with starting off very light.

[Adam Skillin]

I started off light with the deadlift to perfect the form. My squat is somewhere at 5x185, but I started off at 3x5x95 because I wanted to perfect the form too and it's also been a while since I squatted. I assumed that there was nothing wrong with starting off very light.

Your call. It won't take long until the weight is challenging. But you're supposed to add power cleans as soon as the deadlift establishes itself well ahead of the squat. 155 is well ahead of 95. As far as the chins, working so submaximally, I can't see what they'd hurt if you were to include them now.

[nipperkin]

I've had about 5 girls (18-25) deadlift 135 their first day of learning it. None of them weighed more than 140 at the very most. Some of them had never used barbells before, and only 2-3 had some history of typical globo workouts.

Going too light can make some of the lifts harder to perform.

Lol, so now it's possible to screw up by starting too light. Classic Starting Strength.

[Adam Skillin]

Lol, so now it's possible to screw up by starting too light. Classic Starting Strength.

Yeah, I don't think it will hurt you in the long run, personally. My ego wouldn't be able to handle it, but maybe that's my shortcoming. Follow the program, add weight to the bar every session, but I think you are fine to add power cleans and probably/definitely chins without them compromising your progress as long as you do the remaining parts of the program right. That's my unqualified opinion. I've never "coached" anybody to even a 315 deadlift besides myself (a couple in progress), so take my advice for what it's worth.

[Feng_Li]

Lol, so now it's possible to screw up by starting too light. Classic Starting Strength.

It's possible to screw up doing anything. Heavier weights expose technical faults. If the weight is light enough that you can simply power through a poorly-executed lift, you may not realize you are doing anything wrong. If you spend a lot of time practicing something incorrectly, it may be more difficult to correct the problem later. This concept is hardly unique to barbell training.

Of course, if your technique is correct at the light weight, you are simply giving yourself extra form practice before the weights get heavy.