Deadlift question

[Chargerforlife]

The last few deadlift workouts, I have caught myself closing my eyes during the set. It seems to help with awareness of my back angle and I do not notice any issues with balance. I am wondering if this is a bad habit to develop or if it is acceptable?

Thanks, Rip

[Mark Rippetoe]

You can't balance what you can't see. Balance is dependent on your physical relationship to the ground, and your visual reference to it is fairly important.

[Greg C]

Rip:

Not sure I buy this reply - simply for the reason that every blind person would fall on their ass every time they moveed (yes, cheeky response).

To be non-cheeky though, sensory deprivation (single) has a well-documented effect of increasing perception in other senses - i.e. the blind have "more acute" hearing. I don't think it is unreasonable to expect that prioperception may improve when visual stimulus is removed, especially if that is acting as a distraction. For example - squating in front of a mirror, vice not.

Thoughts?

[Mark Rippetoe]

I obviously cannot contradict your experience. But I don't coach it that way, so I'm not going to recommend it as a normal practice.

[mike]

...sensory deprivation (single) has a well-documented effect of increasing perception in other senses...I don't think it is unreasonable to expect that prioperception may improve when visual stimulus is removed, ...Thoughts?

while i certainly agree with your statement, i am not sure it applies in the case of the o/p --- he is a sighted person who who happens to be closing his eyes during short duration of this particular movement - it would seem doubtful that this visual sensory "deprivation" would have any significant impact on his proprioception

even though so many drivers would indicate otherwise ("i always drive better when i'm blind drunk or on the cell phone")

too bad --- could otherwise improve my hearing by closing my eyes and sleeping (am old enough to admit both hearing loss and the need for naps...would have been a nice confluence of necessity)

[Chargerforlife]

I went over the sections in SSBBT dealing with eye position while during the deadlift and I think that I have been looking down rather than a spot on the floor about 10 feet in front. In SSBBT, Rip notes that it is harder to deadlift when looking down and so, I think I have been compensating by closing my eyes. I am going to focus on keeping my eyes open and staring at a spot out in front about 10 feet and see if that helps my lifts. BTW, I am blind in one eye and until about 15 years ago, I was only 20/60 in the good eye with correction. I do have a sense of what GregC is talking about.

[Ryan Dell Whitley]

I have had some questions about this subject as well. I've noticed I can do more pullups, and with more weight, if I close my eyes. This makes no sense whatsoever to me, but I had my friend try it and he had an increase in performance as well. Any thoughts?

[SerusMournstar]

The three factors that influence balance are vision, the vestibular system, and proprioception. Remove one of these and you can still balance remove two and you cannot. The Rhomberg test is a good example: the patient closes their eyes and holds out their arms, if they can't balance there is something wrong with their proprioceptive or vestibular system. Anyway all three are obviously important and it would probably be wise to do it with your eyes open.

[Mark Rippetoe]

I have had some questions about this subject as well. I've noticed I can do more pullups, and with more weight, if I close my eyes. This makes no sense whatsoever to me, but I had my friend try it and he had an increase in performance as well. Any thoughts?

My thoughts are that chins and deadlifts are significantly different tasks. I'll try the blind chins for you, and hell, I may already do a few of them that way without being conscious of it. But I'm pretty sure I won't be deadlifting that way.

[Greg C]

while i certainly agree with your statement, i am not sure it applies in the case of the o/p --- he is a sighted person who who happens to be closing his eyes during short duration of this particular movement - it would seem doubtful that this visual sensory "deprivation" would have any significant impact on his prioperception.

I wasn't sure either, just driving some conversation on the subject. Seemed like an interesting topic I hadn't seen before.

The three factors that influence balance are vision, the vestibular system, and proprioception. Remove one of these and you can still balance remove two and you cannot. The Rhomberg test is a good example: the patient closes their eyes and holds out their arms, if they can't balance there is something wrong with their proprioceptive or vestibular system. Anyway all three are obviously important and it would probably be wise to do it with your eyes open.

Agreed. As an individual living with Meniere's disease (and still training) on a a daily basis, I find all things @ balance interesting/important and agree eyes open is probably a better way to go.

But I don't coach it that way, so I'm not going to recommend it as a normal practice.

Rip: certainly was suggesting you do so, was just interested in your thoughts. VR GAC