Third Time's a Charm

[Matt Dawson]

Matt - I had the same problem a couple of years back - Listing to the left, with the occasional dive-bomb of that side coming out of the hole. During an in-person visit with an SSC, it turned out that it was a minor leg length discrepancy, with my right leg being just a touch longer. Not enough to put a plate under that foot or a piece of matting, but enough. I now shift that right foot a bit forward of my left (visually lining up the heels, not the toes) and I haven't had an issue for almost two years now. See if someone can sight your leg lengths, with your shoes on.

Whatever you do, don't be shifting leftward under the bar. Long term, that's going to tweak things that aren't worth tweaking.

Keep at it!

I think you're on to something and some in person coaching is in order. I'd love to quit tweaking my back every few months.

[Bill Anders]

If you can't get to an in-person session easily, a video shot at 45° from behind would help, right side preferable to left.

On your video directly behind, it sure looks like your heels are directly in-line with each other, which is good until it's not. If you're going to explore this in your garage, do it with something like 225lbs, heavy enough to replicate the heavier lifts, but not too heavy to tweak something if you keep good form. It shouldn't take too much adjustment of that right foot forward to level out that bar, say 1/4"-3/4".

Full standard disclaimer of not being an SSC, nor having slept at a Holiday Inn Express last night. But during a recent visit to a Starting Strength gym and watching a couple of the classes, there were a large number of shims being used, so the discrepancy is more common than we like to think.

[Matt Dawson]

Squat 380x5x1; 365x5x2
Bench 260x3x1, 260x2x1; 235x5x3
Chins 7, 7, 6, 6, 5

[Matt Dawson]

For what it's worth here's 225 from a rear 45° and directly behind. Not sure what if anything you can tell from the 45. I know my left knee is tracking too wide but I haven't figured out the fix yet. If one leg is longer than the other I can't tell which.

[Bill Anders]

For what it's worth here's 225 from a rear 45° and directly behind. Not sure what if anything you can tell from the 45.

Thanks for those, Matt.

re: the 45°, it was helpful to verify that you've got a lot of knee slide going on there, which may be contributing to your left knee tracking too wide. On your 375x5x3 video it's apparent when your knees shoot backwards when you come out of the hole. Fix those knees on the descent and keep them there through the hole and on the way back up. Related to the bar tilting? Not likely, but something that you'll want to fix. I also wanted to see how much you shifted your right foot forward, which it looks like you did slightly, which was good.

I know my left knee is tracking too wide but I haven't figured out the fix yet. If one leg is longer than the other I can't tell which.

re: the rear view - it's not quite so apparent how far you shifted your right foot forward, but your bar does not seem to be tilting left as much as it was on your 375x5 set. If anything, it starts to dip to the right as you're coming out of the hole. It could be some compensation with these lighter weights, but other than the knee slide, they looked good and didn't give any indication of the issues that you were having with tilt on the 375x5 set.

Based on your 375x5 video and how the bar moved, your right leg would be the longer one. By shifting it a bit forward, it effectively shortens it. Another way to compensate would be to keep your heels even with each other, but use one of your 1.25lb or 2.5lb plates under your left foot. Again, try this with the lighter weights to see how it goes. Better yet would be if you have a spare square of matting or two that you could put under your left foot, one at a time until you find the right height; those are better since they're a larger target and there wouldn't be a tendency for it to shift around like a small plate might.

Keep at it!

[Matt Dawson]

Light Squat 315x5x2
Press 182.5x5x3
Deadlift 435x5x1

[Matt Dawson]

re: the 45°, it was helpful to verify that you've got a lot of knee slide going on there, which may be contributing to your left knee tracking too wide.

Yeah I'm a chronic knee slider. Can't fix everything at once.

Based on your 375x5 video and how the bar moved, your right leg would be the longer one. By shifting it a bit forward, it effectively shortens it. Another way to compensate would be to keep your heels even with each other, but use one of your 1.25lb or 2.5lb plates under your left foot. Again, try this with the lighter weights to see how it goes. Better yet would be if you have a spare square of matting or two that you could put under your left foot, one at a time until you find the right height; those are better since they're a larger target and there wouldn't be a tendency for it to shift around like a small plate might.

Keep at it!

I appreciate your feedback and suggestions. I had previously thought it was the right leg that might be shorter because of the way my pelvis was tilted lower on the right. Tried shimming the left foot on warm-ups today and will have to review the video.

[Matt Dawson]

Squat 385x5x1; 365x5x2
Bench 225x5x5
Chins 7, 7, 5

[Bill Anders]

Yeah I'm a chronic knee slider. Can't fix everything at once.

I appreciate your feedback and suggestions. I had previously thought it was the right leg that might be shorter because of the way my pelvis was tilted lower on the right. Tried shimming the left foot on warm-ups today and will have to review the video.

I'd argue (and probably the coaches would too) that fixing your knee slide is much more important than fixing a slight leg-length discrepancy, especially now that you're approaching 400lbs with that squat. Every bit of that slide is bleeding tension out of your hamstrings, glutes, and back once you're down in the hole, not to mention the strain that you're adding to your knees when you do that. It's a bit crude, but a cue that an SSC gave me was initially "Point your a$$hole to the wall", which got the hips pointed further back. Once that was settled, then it was "Belt between the thighs" to get the back angle right. No TUBOW required, although I'm sure that would have come out had I not followed the cues. Later on I found that box squats on the light days reinforced those moves.

Honestly you could fix both at the same time, but if you would rather not, prioritize knee slide over shimming.

Keep at it!

[Matt Dawson]

February 4
Incline DB Press 60x10x3
Band assisted chins 3x10

February 5
Squat 365x5x3
Press 185x5x3