Squat Weight Increase + Value of Cleans + Damn Pull Ups

[stlrick]

51 Year old male using expanded novice 5 10' 225 lbs

1. At 290, squats are getting tough. Does it make sense to drop to 2.5 lb increases or keep adding 5 lbs to failure?
2. I've seen mention that cleans are not the useful for older folks. How would a person make the decision to stop doing cleans and what is the recommended substitute exercise?
3. Since I suck at pull ups, I decided to try as hard as I could. Ending up hurting the inside of my elbow. Is there a pull up substitute or maybe a tutorial sensibly training pull ups?

Thanks everybody

[Satch12879]

On chin-ups/pull-ups, from the boards:

http://startingstrength.com/resource...gressions.html

In summary, you make use of the Rage Fitness Pull-Up Assistance tool, along with a program for using it and building your pull-up/chin-up ability. Reads as a nice, rational program to me. I'm going to be adding this in when I'm back from hiatus.

[MashedTaters]

Yeah, what mgilchrest said. You may need to back off the volume a bit.

If you're increasing weight every week, it might be time to increase only once every 2 or 3 weeks. That is, an alternative progression might be something like the following:

Week 1: 290x5x3
Week 2: 300x3x3
Week 3: 310x1x3

Week 4: 295x5x3
Week 5: 305x3x3
etc.

You also might do a small reset and begin the progression with, I dunno, 275. Regardless, the break in volume in Weeks 2 and 3 will give you time for the fatigue from Week 1 to dissipate.

Just my humble thoughts.

[Walter Palmer]

In regards to pull-ups, experiment with different grips. For many with elbow issues, me included, a neutral grip (palms facing each other) with a relatively narrow grip help alleviate the strain on the elbows. Try overhand, underhand, and neutral and see if one grip is easier for you in regards to stress on the elbow.

[iamsmuts]

Art of Manliness and Scooby Fitness (sigh) both have videos. Scooby's is tolerable, only because he does a nice job demonstrating the build up. Basically you'll need to start with negatives and static holds.

I think the Scooby tutorial is very good. I used it. So did my wife. When I started I could barely get 3 chins. . . . GMB also has a recent pull up tutorial. They have several good progressions for different things, such as hand stands and muscle ups.

[George Christiansen]

51 Year old male using expanded novice 5 10' 225 lbs

1. At 290, squats are getting tough. Does it make sense to drop to 2.5 lb increases or keep adding 5 lbs to failure?
2. I've seen mention that cleans are not the useful for older folks. How would a person make the decision to stop doing cleans and what is the recommended substitute exercise?
3. Since I suck at pull ups, I decided to try as hard as I could. Ending up hurting the inside of my elbow. Is there a pull up substitute or maybe a tutorial sensibly training pull ups?

Thanks everybody

1- Getting tough as in missing reps or just difficult?
2- If you are already doing and enjoying them without issues then go with it, but they are the least important lift in the SSLP. RDL's, SLDL's, or some other pull would substitute, but you may not need to. Many people do no other real pull other than deadlifts.
3- Submaximal efforts seem of a lot of reps, done regularly seem to work for most people If you can do any at all. Form and grip could be the issue with your elbow.

[Mark E. Hurling]

In lieu of pull-ups you could do barbell rows. But be sure to do them with the form as recommended by Rip in SS:3.

[carson]

A 68 year old woman in our gym does Power Snatches and I think Cleans. She is an exception. I can't do them. Most people in their 50s do them in our gym. But has been suggested the dynamic moves are less and less possible as we age...usually.

[stlrick]

Original Poster Replies

1. Squats: I decided to go up 5 lbs a week as long as possible. Since the bump up will occur on each Saturday - after a 2 day rest - I’m hoping for the best. Up to this point, I have managed to complete my work sets - although I did drop back to 280 after being forced to miss a Monday and a Wednesday due to work/life conflicts.

Has anyone added a back-off set on the squats - say taking off 50 for another set of 5. (I thought I read that is helpful somewhere on these forums)

2. Pull-Ups: I wish I had all these great links before I tweaked my elbow. Ironic that after months of lifting weights I end up hurting myself on a non-weighted exercise. Luckily, the tweaked elbow didn’t interfere with squats, bench/standing lifts or deadlifts.

3. Power Snatches: I need to go through the suggestions to make a decision. Since I’ve skipped the Power Snatches, my back has not been as “tight” so that is a positive. I also wonder if I might have been doing them slightly wrong since they are a skilled move.

4. Looking ahead: I’m really going to dig into the nutrition portion of this site. I know I can eat cleaner than I do with a bit more planning. All the exercises have reached a point where all the work sets are hard. The plan is to squeeze as much out of being a novice as possible. It will be interesting to see how much this 51 year old body can continue to progress.

[VNV]

2. Pull-Ups: I wish I had all these great links before I tweaked my elbow.

FWIW, it'll heal. I'm 48, have given myself golfer's (I think) elbow twice on the right arm, and with time and attention, it has healed. But each time, it took months. I just got over the 2nd incident a couple of weeks ago, which started around early September. More focused rehab might have sped up the process. Instead, I simply reset the offending movement, and slowed down the weekly progression. Memory is not serving at the moment, and logbook isn't at hand. I don't recall exactly what led up to the most recent injury. Possibly intensity chins, or a bad power clean.